Penner: So, um, it’s not… we now know what we need to do in every state and what it would cost and how we do it um, so it’s
really about pulling the trigger if… if we decide we want to do it.
Biden: When would you have to do that?
Penner: Uh, it’s a while so um, and again, it kind of depends on on what the exact approach is, and who it is, and who’s not just…
who the platform is, but who else is running… like there’s a few decision points along the way, but it could be as late as like spring of um,
uh, you know, spring of 2020 what would be the latest well…
Biden: My question is you have to make that decision to pull the trigger… uh… being on the ballot before um, before uh… people…
Penner: Before the either party nomination
Biden: Yeah…yeah
Penner: That’s part of it, not necessarily… I mean you could um, I mean you can pull it late I mean we could pull the trigger… this I mean
we can pull the trigger on uh, getting some, you know something in place on these different ballots and again it depends by state um, where
we wouldn’t even have to have necessarily (sic) a specific candidate but um, um, but I think it all seems um, of interest, and and we know it’s of
interest to John, uh… to at least, you know, have a conversation um, you know if, uh, your dad was at all intrigued by it we could figure out
a way to facilitate you know I could fly john out and you know you…
Biden: can…
Penner: …just be off the record you know…
Biden: yeah…
Penner: …face to face, it could be, if you know, if that’s not of interest, we could get you know a couple of political advisors together
to talk about it, like there’s different ways to approach it…
Biden: Can I…
Penner: …depending on what if you had any interest
Biden: Yeah but look I think that um, I think, number one that it’s gonna be, this is all me, not him okay?
Penner: Yeah, yeah
Biden: I think that it’s going to be very difficult for him not to run um, because I think that whether it’s the party or whether it’s um,
whether it’s people like you to tell you the truth um, the the overall um, objective here is to stop not only Donald Trump but to stem the
tide of what Donald Trump represents um, in the political process for the…
Penner: Yeah
Biden: …future of this country which to me is is uh is way more dangerous than i ever thought that it possibly could be
Penner: uh huh…
Biden: …and um, my concern is um I, kind of dropped out of this for, just, I’m tired of this shit but um…
Penner: Yeah!
Biden: …but I think it’s kind of almost unpatriotic not to um, to be back into it particularly related to my, my, my relationship with somebody that
actually could change it and so I think the danger of he and John having any discussion right now is, uh, emboldening um, the supporters of
those, we’ll call them, for lack of better phrase, fringe candidates, because they are no longer fringe candidates in the sense of, uh, they can win nominations
and yeah they could potentially become president and so…
Penner: Yeah
Biden: …they are um, they’re legitimate candidates as Donald Trump has proven, and so…
Penner: Yeah
Biden: …I think for um, for him uh, right now to have that um, discussion is um, is premature, particularly when he hasn’t even announced, but between you and me and um, but it’s, I don’t think any secret. You know my dad’s entire career has been about um, fulfilling the service that you’re, uh, that you’re asked um, to fulfill. I’m… based upon…
Penner: Yeah
Biden: …you know the way that you lived your life in terms of, uh of doing that getting up and doing what needs to be done I don’t know how he does it, except I, there’s some kind of… but by the way he has more energy than you know I mean, literally he’s doing, he’s doing like five to literally five to, three to five um, events a day…
Penner: Right…right
Biden: …is from Florida, he’s in Buffalo right now and whether he’s running or not he’d be doing it…
Penner: Yeah…yeah
Biden: …and um, so, I mean, I can’t keep up with him that’s not a joke
Penner: Yeah
Biden: …but I mean seriously great, I mean it’s all, I mean, my whole life…
Penner: Yeah
Biden: …it just is so demoralizing because I’m in good shape man, I swear.
Penner: Right… right. Well these guys I mean we know they’re certain they’re just sort of born to be politicians and they feed, they get
energy off of it, it doesn’t, it’s not draining, obviously it gets draining at some point, but it’s more of an energizer than a drainer
Biden: Yeah…no, you’re right… you’re right. Anyway regardless of the of all that issue, I think that he proved to people that that’s not an issue,
but I think that um, obviously if you’re able to do this in the traditional way um, I think that the entire, you know, uh, there’s a, there’s a, a,
uh, a non-partisan or even a partisan but moderate um, uh, coalition that forms that allows him to, uh, to win, win at all that’s my opinion however…
Penner: Yeah
Biden: …who the hell knows, I mean any of this stuff and so…
Penner: Yeah
Biden: but I think I… this is me again…
Penner: Yeah
Biden: …no matter what, I’d rather him run that way… I would rather, I think for the country… I think that it would be an opportunity to um,
to actually start to heal these divisions…
Penner: Yeah
Biden: …because the the space between what you believe, Greg, and what I believe is so thin…
Penner: Right
Biden: …and we’ve allowed everybody else to tell us, and tell the people that coalesce behind our [inaudible] camps that it’s wide, that it’s really wide,
and it’s not man it truly isn’t.
Penner: uh huh
Biden: You know the vilification of Donald… uh, of uh… of George Bush was you know I… when I… when George Bush was president was just as um,
disconcerting to me as a vilification of, of uh, Barack Obama…
Penner: Right
Biden: …and so, I don’t think that, that ever necessarily changes but you know what? If you and I um, or not you and I…
Penner: Yeah
Biden: …If John and Joe were ever able to kind of, repair that, that’s a big big leap forward potentially…
Penner: Yeah
Biden: …and so…
Penner: Yeah
Biden: …anyway what, I want… I want to do is, is uh, is maybe um, lets you and I have uh, one more discussion after I talk to him. I’m gonna
be with him, uh, tomorrow and through Saturday, okay?
Penner: Okay
Biden: …and we have a… I’m going to New York with him for a couple campaign events he’s doing an upstate and then down to the city
for some fundraiser for somebody and so um, let me let me just, uh, you don’t know this but let me, let me talk to him…
Penner: Yeah
Biden: …and I think there has to be a couple meetings before there’s ever a meeting um…
Penner: Yeah
Biden: …with the principles yeah, and so…
Penner: Yeah
Biden: …but i really appreciate the call because you know, kind of to me I’ve always said to him, you know, whether it was Bloomberg, or Kasich, or
anybody, you know, in order to really heal, you got to start to actually um, do the things that, uh, that give people reason to believe, you know what I mean…
Penner: Yeah
Biden: …so yeah, so anyway
Penner: Yeah, yeah I’m with ya
Biden: I’m anyway…
Penner: Yeah
Biden: …and then, and then, and then if it ever happened then it is then it’s the bloodbath of like, inside internally
Penner: Right
Biden: You know, but you know what? I’d rather that fight than the fight that’s occurring right now, which is, which is just awful, man, awful.
Penner: Yeah, yeah
Biden: You know, jesus christ, he kind of, you know, I mean awful
Penner: Yeah, yeah
Biden: I can’t watch the news anymore man.
Penner: Right
Biden: I mean I really don’t, I don’t watch it. Yeah somebody told me today, “sorry, sorry, sorry to hear about your dad”. I panicked, I said, “what happened?”
I mean it was like the bomb the thing I was like, “oh my god thank god it was only…”
Penner: Right
Biden: “…it was only a bomb”
Penner: All right
Biden: All right brother, yeah. But yeah there’s a bunch of other people that have approached me about it from you know uh Felix Rohatyn’s
son, I don’t know if you know um, Nick Rohatyn (Chairman of TRG aka Rohatyn Group), who’s a really really impressive guy
Penner: Yeah, yeah
Biden: Nick is um, I think he’s been very involved in this, and um, and so anyway I’m, I’m not getting ahead of myself but I’m just saying to you
there’s a number of other people, um, of your um, stature, uh, that are [inaudible] can really, actually affect change in this country
um, that I think that you would also like to meet it if you haven’t already. So anyway buddy I appreciate the call let me call you back
tomorrow okay, after I talk to him tomorrow late evening or afternoon.
Penner: Okay, yep sounds good
Biden: Okay
Penner: Thanks, Hunter
Biden: Okay
